Interview with David Morrow: Using the Law to Seize the Profits of Fraud

The 27th episode of the Commsrisk podcast features David Morrow, a consultant and expert in fraud management. Dave knows about fraud around the globe from his time as Vodafone Group’s Corporate Security Fraud Manager, and by working closely with international bodies like the GSMA Fraud and Security Group. As great as Dave’s international experience is, some problems need to be dealt with on a national level, though a successful solution in one country could potentially be copied by others. Dave’s current preoccupation is the fact that UK law includes the power to confiscate the profits generated by telecoms fraudsters, but practical obstacles mean it is rarely used. He believes the UK’s Proceeds of Crime Act (POCA) could be exploited more effectively, and that telcos in other countries will find themselves in a similar position because of the worldwide push to implement laws that address money laundering.

Listen to the podcast to benefit from a deep dive into the subject of using the law to seize the assets of fraudsters. Dave explains why he believes UK law could be better utilized to fight crime, the reasons to believe the same approach would work in other countries, and advice for how you can join his campaign.

Black Swan Editor and regular co-host Dan Baker also joined us for the podcast. Dan shared his insights, drawing upon his experience as a writer of research reports into telecoms fraud management.

If you want to listen to the podcast via your browser, you only need to press the ‘play’ button above. Or those who prefer to download the mp3 file can do so using this link.

I believe Dave makes an impressive argument. We could eliminate the profit motive for fraudsters, if only some telcos and police forces have the courage to show the necessary leadership. There are several ways you can join and support Dave’s campaign.

  • Contact the POCA Telecoms Fraud Campaign team via its page at the Risk & Assurance Group. If your telco has proof it was the victim of fraud then the campaign team has the advice and contacts to help you recover your telco’s money.
  • We intend to draft and circulate a public letter, aimed at telco executives and Members of Parliament, to raise awareness of the potential for POCA to be used to fight telecoms fraud. Visit the campaign site and let us know if you will support us by signing the letter.
  • If you know about the levels of fraud and confiscation in other countries then please get in touch. The campaign wants to start benchmarking between nations to highlight how much more can be done to stem the flow of money to criminals.
  • Learn more about POCA and the reasons to use it to fight crime by reading this article. It explains how we could work with law enforcement agencies and the obstacles we need to overcome.

New installments of the Commsrisk podcast are released once a quarter. There are various services that can be used to subscribe to the podcast, so you never miss a future episode. For example, the podcast has a dedicated page on iTunes, or Android users can obtain it via Blubrry.

Eric Priezkalns
Eric Priezkalns
Eric is the Editor of Commsrisk. Look here for more about the history of Commsrisk and the role played by Eric.

Eric is also the Chief Executive of the Risk & Assurance Group (RAG), a global association of professionals working in risk management and business assurance for communications providers.

Previously Eric was Director of Risk Management for Qatar Telecom and he has worked with Cable & Wireless, T‑Mobile, Sky, Worldcom and other telcos. He was lead author of Revenue Assurance: Expert Opinions for Communications Providers, published by CRC Press. He is a qualified chartered accountant, with degrees in information systems, and in mathematics and philosophy.